- Aug 19, 2008
Actually I'm not so sure of that, since we've mixed it up a bit in the past in these forums. But anyway...ramoncio said:wiseoldowl don't get mad with dicko, we are all here for good and he's just trying to help you. He wouldn't write so long and detailed posts if his goal was just to annoy you.
I guess all I can say is that the Nerd Vittles article I was trying to follow never mentioned a thing about that. I know it's not your fault or the fault of anyone here, but I think their article leads you to believe that it's going to be a simple "copy and paste" thing, where if you follow their recipe it just works.Have a look here:
Skype managers don't want users to run without a gui
So if you don't want to install X, forget about Skype.you would be violating the skype license if you incorporate this into a program that uses the skype API to do something useful.
It appears that if you want to use it you must have X working full time.
Well, since this is a private system and not being used for commercial purposes, I'm not too concerned about being able to see (or not see) the Skype client. The sense I'm getting from all this is that the Nerd Vittles article has some major omissions, at least from the standpoint of people who are not running their pre-cooked distributions. But I do wonder if, when you run this on one of their systems, they are paying any attention to the Skype license.Or you can do what madis_l_ says in that post.
This seems to be the bare minimum resources you have to waste.Skype runs quite well on 1x3 pixel virtual desktop (TightVNC server version 1.2.9) without window manager.
I've never tried that though. I thought you needed to have a window manager installed to use uvnc.
I'll say this much about that. First of all, I've been using computers back since the day of the Commodore PET and TRS-80 Model I, which gives you a bit of a clue as to my age. I don't know how old most of the folks in this forum are but I can tell you that after you pass the half-century mark it gets harder and harder to store and process new information. You may not understand that now, but you will when you get older. I'm not yet at the point of not being able to set the clock on my VCR (yes, I still have one!) but learning a whole new operating system, after having dealt with both Windows and Mac OS X, is not high on my list of things I'm just dying to do.On the other hand, if I were you, I would experiment a little with Linux. It is really cool, not just as server-based apps.
At least I would recommend you to read some CentOS/Redhat basic tutorials. Services and basic system management, cronjobs, kernel, modules, logfiles, postfix, users, groups, permissions , apache, mysql, php, and asterisk of course, because Elastix is running on top of all that. The more you know about all that, the better your servers will perform. And in case of trouble all your knowledge will be needed.
But the other thing is that my attitude toward the command line is that it is what we had to suffer with under MS-DOS (and the operating systems of the first home computers, that ran off a floppy disk!). The first time I got my hands on Windows 3.1 it was like "I don't have to type things in at the command line anymore?!" and I was thrilled, to put it mildly. Many if not most Linux users (and not a few Mac users, I might add) seem to want to use their keyboard rather than their mouse. Not me - the only time I use the keyboard is for typing messages and such, and then only because speech recognition is still in its infancy.
Nevertheless I tried Kubuntu Linux a couple of years ago because everyone said it was so easy to use. Suffice it to say that I did not have a good experience with it. I literally spent two days once trying to figure out how to do something (connect to another machine on the network) that would have taken me maybe one minute in Windows. It turned out that you needed to have some particular line in etc/fstab (I think it was) but it would take several paragraphs to describe what I went through to figure that out. Some people enjoy those kinds of challenges - I don't. When I get in a car, I don't want to have to tinker with the engine to make it run, and when I turn on a computer I don't want to have to deal with a lot of text-based crap if I don't have to. Sometimes you do have to, but I'll take a GUI any day (one reason I was so hot to install Webmin on this system).
The thing about something like Elastix is, it's all based on a GUI - you install the disk and however many minutes later you have a working system and a very nice web-based GUI that you can use, so even when you do have to type something you're probably looking a text box with a meaningful label, not a bash command prompt. I would never in a million years attempt to compile and install Asterisk and FreePBX from scratch as some have done - not only don't I think I could do it successfully, but it would not in the slightest be an enjoyable experience for me.
So when I come across a page of instructions like those on the Nerd Vittles site, if they're not too long I may try them, thinking that hopefully I can't screw up anything too badly. But when something goes wrong, what I'm looking for is another list of instructions or commands that show exactly what needs to be done to fix it. The blessing and the curse of the Nerd Vittles site is that many of their instructions guide you down a very narrow path - virtually anyone can follow them but if they omit a step or you run into problems, you are dead in the water. And when you are done, you have something with their fingerprint on it (the "mothership" context, for example), which may not be how you'd do it if you really understood what they are doing. But on the other hand, if all goes well you'll have it up and running in 15 minutes. If things don't go well, that's another story...
But please understand that I'm probably like 90% of all the computer users out there - I really DON'T want to mess around "under the hood." Give me a nice GUI to control the things you mentioned and I'll use them, maybe. Doing something like trying to install this sip/Skype gateway is very rare for me; normally I wouldn't even tackle something like this but another family member has been wanting it and I was actually fooled into thinking it might be easy.
I do have a slightly different attitude toward FreePBX and Elastix, by the way - I'm not quite as adverse to trying to understand a short dial plan fragment, for example. But for some reason that stuff seems far more logical to me than most Linux commands. I don't know why. Why can I understand perl or bash scripts a little bit (very little, but still..) while php or C looks like total gibberish to me? I don't know. Maybe it's something in the way my brain is wired. :blink:
So what if something happens to take the server down, or we really mess something up? Simple - stick the Elastix ISO back in the drive and start from scratch. Or maybe try and restore a backup, assuming I can figure out how. On a home system, you can do that (not saying people wouldn't get upset, but in the long run it would be far faster to reinstall and start over than to try, and probably fail to figure out how to fix the problem). Fortunately I've never had to do that on an emergency basis - one thing about CentOS, Asterisk, FreePBX and Elastix is that they combine to make a VERY stable system. But that also explains why I get so nervous about installing things that can seriously impact the stability of the system (like a desktop, perhaps?).
I'm glad there are people who love to tinker around with Linux, just as I am glad there are people who love to work on cars, or to get into a bucket truck to fix hundred thousand volt electric distribution wires, or whatever. I just don't care to do those things. Anyway, sorry for the digression, but hopefully it helps you understand where I am coming from.
If there are two things I'd take away from this experience, it is these:
1) Don't be too quick to trust instructions on the Nerd Vittles site. What they put there will probably work on their system (PiaF) but there is a lesser chance it will work on Elastix, at least without some serious tweaking.
2) Maybe, just maybe, it would not be such a bad idea for future versions of Elastix to come with X Windows and a minimal desktop. I'm sure you could start wars between the people who think there is already too much in the Elastix ISO and those who would like to see more, and I don't wish to start such a discussion in this thread, but I will just note that it appears that PiaF must come with this stuff already included, otherwise their users would be having the same issues that I am.
Okay, I'll shut up now and go eat my dinner!