Elastix Forum Sux

Discussion in 'General' started by elastixguy, Apr 26, 2008.

  1. elastixguy

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2008
    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    0
    It's poorly designed and squeezed between two useless columns.

    And this causes the Forum to be unpopular. Which is a major problem if one ever need to rely on the community.

    Someone needs to do something about it.

    You should at least remove these 2 annoying columns which surround the content, thus making room for the forum itself.

    As of Elastix distro, I love it and always say good things about it to my friends. But this forum is a pain in the ass.
     
  2. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
    Elastixguy: You are absolutely right. But what I witnessed so far are deaf ears and blind eyes from the developers! You will find enough evidence from my comments at:

    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... orum+admin

    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... +Encuestas

    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... iew&id=117

    I feel like going back to TB as several of my forum posts were never answered (it never happened at TB forum). Free software is about the support rather than product itself!
     
  3. CleveJ

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    0
  4. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
  5. nothings_found

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2007
    Messages:
    72
    Likes Received:
    0
    Stop sending users to other forums. What the hell is your problem. If you or people start going to different forums you do not help the site.

    Because then you will have answers to multiple issues on different forums. And not on one single place where things can be easily found.

    If you are serious about helping this cause/distro then help out here in the forum any way you can.
     
  6. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
    nothings_found:

    I agree that visiting several forums would not help the Elastix development, but it is worth considering why they prefer to visit other sites.

    Let me give you my own example I posted a topic at http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... tid=3#6350 and then I made a reference to the stated topic here: http://www.elastixconnection.com/index. ... 1&catid=28

    If you were in my shoes, where do you prefer to be in terms of the repsonse. So StillLearning is right! Actually I landed at elastixconnection.com due to the FreePBX-ARI integration at the first place.

    Second, I have several threads that were never replied here, but if I ask same questions at TB-forum, I get response within an hour's time. Examples for you to consider are:

    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... tid=5#6139
    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... tid=1#5921
    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... id=15#5918
    http://www.elastix.org/index.php?option ... iew&id=117 (see my post)

    You can also find my question about openfire enterprise edition integration in the forum, but never addressed. Now think about being in my shoes (I already solved some of the issues already).

    Now, tell me how can Elastix-users NOT swing from this forum to where they get the community support instantly? If not, why the Elastix-team does not seem to pay attention to the very valid claims of its users?!

    Something somewhere is wrong here in this forum. The burden of proof lies in the administrators of the forum, I think. ;-)
     
  7. Bob

    Bob

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2,400
    Likes Received:
    1
    Zenny & others,

    You have got to realise that Elastix is an Open Source product that consists of other Open Source products, which I am sure that you do.

    You must be aware that Open Source very rarely brings in any money for the developers directly.

    As such, any community based support will be community based with the addition of as much support as the developers can afford while in most cases completing their PAID work (e.g. feeding family, keeping a roof over their head).

    Waiting a day or two, may be the necessary case, especially on questions that others have had no interest in (e.g. they have not tried themselves).

    Should your need be urgent, you could possibly take the Official Support (Paid Option) provided by Elastix.

    I agree the forums are not ideal on Elastix.org, but again this all takes time. I for one would rather see the spare time that they have put into the Core Elastix product which is continuing to become a fantastic product.

    You mention that you can get quicker response on Trixbox forums, and I probably say that you may be correct, but you also have a Forum and a community that has had a much longer time to build, a name that has been out there longer. Trixbox is also commercially backed by Fonality, which has an interest in promoting the Trixbox name hoping to migrate people to the commercial product. They have people like Kerry and others to build the Website/forum, to answer questions as their livelihood depends on it.

    I for one would not like the Elastix product to go the same way, with certain features only available in the paid product such as the Call Centre Module and/or the fax module etc.

    You have got to remember that also the people that are replying in the forum also have daytime jobs, and don't always have time to get onto the forum, or if they do they are selective (due to time) on what they reply to.

    I had a quick look at those questions, and some of them show that you have not put much time into answering them yourself via google or the forum, so why do you want or expect that others will spend more time than yourself to answer them.

    I have had questions that I felt were ignored as well such as the Chan_mobile. I have been checking this and writing in the forums for the last month about it, with very little response. I recognise that this product is very diverse and focus is probably not on a little used feature. In the meantime I have done research myself, tested each release of Elastix, provided as much feedback as I can (this was at the time they were trying to release 1.0 Stable) . Now I note that Edgar has answered another user asking the question, so again I provide feedback, which he has asked for, and I guess that he has a little more time to focus on this function within Elastix.

    An Opensource product is only as good as the community that embraces it and supports it, and this takes time to build. Many are recognising that Elastix is going somewhere and more and more are learning about it, and each person brings that little bit more to the community, each person with their own specialty and capability. It requires everyone to help, even in small areas.

    Take a look around, and see what you can contribute in a small or large way. Just take a look at the forums, some are trying to actively answer questions based on their experience, others such as Ben are writing guides. Ben is not the most brilliant guy in the world (sorry Ben), but what he is good at is writing (spelling is not one of his fortes either), and compiling, and delving into issues, even if he can't work out an answer, he gets to the crux of the issue and reports that. This is his contribution to the Elastix Project and a damn bloody good one at that.

    Another person on the forums took the Spanish Call Centre guide and translated it to English. He took on a project and gave it it a go. Now its available on this Website. Others have translated the User manual into various languages, this is their contribution.

    Myself personally, as mentioned, I felt the forums on Elastix were not ideal, I have spoken to Edgar about it a while back, and instead of knocking the team, I recognised that they may not have the resources, so I setup another Elastix Forum site, with the setup I thought it needed. Actually the start of it came from providing Ben with a location for Elastix Without Tears and a small forum area, which quickly switched to a full Forum and a Website promoting Elastix. This is what I could do to contribute...Furthermore, I have contributed approximately about 35-40 Pages to Bens Guide, again, this is what I could do....

    This partly why I personally did not respond to your question on IMAP. Firstly I have never seen that error, and it sounds like many others haven't, and also I found that the time was more useful writing the Email guide for EWT that was going to benefit everyone (which from one of the Elastix.org forum posts it did). However I did respond to your post, telling you it was being written.

    Others may provide hardware to the Developers to test and integrate with assistance, that is their contribution.

    As for worrying about two forum sites, and having to switch between them to look for answers. If you haven't got the time for that, then Open Source products are definitely not the products that you need.

    As for Elastixconnection, it was setup with the focus on the forums and Website, meaning that response to changes to the forums and Website, have a stronger focus. George on Elastixconnection is regularly passing comments and changes needed to correct small issues. If it becomes popular and excels, then great, if it doesn't go anywhere, that's fine also, at least I know that I have tried to contribute to the community in some way.

    I am not trying to be critical of anyone asking for help, or providing constructive criticism, but blanket statements of Elastix Forum Sux wouldn't endear the developers to bother responding or feel like they want do anything about it.

    Everyone can help this Open Source product, you just need to to decide whether you want to be part of the community that embraces it and contribute in any small or large way.

    Regards

    Bob<br><br>Post edited by: Bob, at: 2008/05/01 04:02
     
  8. BenS

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2007
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    0
    What you are trying to say there Bob are: 1. I am spastic and 2. my spelling sux... You may be right there on both counts (you forgot to mention that I am also a Dirty Old Man).. what do you expect from a 2 fingered typist? A Shakespear rendition of Mid Summer Night's Dream? Especially when trying to maintain Trixbox2 without Tears and Elastix without Tears. Can you imagine 2 fingers typing 300 pages documents and checking your own mistake as well?... LOL But I can tell you that I made up my shortcomings in other ways.. Like making mean Curry and Vegemite on Toasts.. LOL. Wait till you come around and I will contribute some rat poison in your cup of tea...<just kidding Bob>.

    OFF TOPIC!!!!!

    Back on topic....

    I concur with everything Bob said. This person Zenny or whoever he/she may be seems to me pretty self centered... I want, I want, I want and everyone should drop everything and solve his problem, but I have not seen any contribution from him/her that is beneficial to this forum community. "The forum sux" is hardly beneficial.

    We as a community tried to help each other provided that we are in the position to do so and have the solutions that were required. I got lots of help from the community and on my part I tried to contribute by compiling the guide and answer a few questions in the forums if and when I know the answer. Have it ever occurred to you Zenny that we may not have the answer yet?

    What substantial contribution have you made Zenny? Apart from bad mouthing the developers and the forum administrators, let me tell you something.. You have contributed nothing apart from whinging. Your belittling the developers and the forum administrators means that you are belittling the whole community.

    Maybe when you have grown up a little and stop playing with your dinky toys maybe and just maybe you will be mature enough with your comments and stop telling the community how the forums sux and nobody care to help poor little you.

    Live long and prosper Zenny despite your attitude.
     
  9. BenS

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2007
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    0
    What you are trying to say there Bob are: 1. I am spastic and 2. my spelling sux... You may be right there on both counts (you forgot to mention that I am also a Dirty Old Man).. what do you expect from a 2 fingered typist? A Shakespear rendition of Mid Summer Night's Dream? Especially when trying to maintain Trixbox2 without Tears and Elastix without Tears. Can you imagine 2 fingers typing 300 pages documents and checking your own mistake as well?... LOL But I can tell you that I made up my shortcomings in other ways.. Like making mean Curry and Vegemite on Toasts.. LOL. Wait till you come around and I will contribute some rat poison in your cup of tea...<just kidding Bob>.

    OFF TOPIC!!!!!

    Back on topic....

    I concur with everything Bob said. This person Zenny or whoever he/she may be seems to me pretty self centered... I want, I want, I want and everyone should drop everything and solve his problem, but I have not seen any contribution from him/her that is beneficial to this forum community. "The forum sux" is hardly beneficial.

    We as a community tried to help each other provided that we are in the position to do so and have the solutions that were required. I got lots of help from the community and on my part I tried to contribute by compiling the guide and answer a few questions in the forums if and when I know the answer. Have it ever occurred to you Zenny that we may not have the answer yet?

    What substantial contribution have you made Zenny? Apart from bad mouthing the developers and the forum administrators, let me tell you something.. You have contributed nothing apart from whinging. Your belittling the developers and the forum administrators means that you are belittling the whole community.

    Maybe when you have grown up a little and stop playing with your dinky toys maybe and just maybe you will be mature enough with your comments and stop telling the community how the forums sux and nobody care to help poor little you.

    Live long and prosper Zenny despite your attitude.
     
  10. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bob and Ben:

    I tried to reply with some fundamental issues but it made me log out from the forum forcefully (i reported about it earlier) too.) So I am replying below as I do not have energy to retype again.

    However I noticed that you have pretty good knack of explaining things in a subjective way. Try to be objective. I would have answered your propositions quite objectively, but I refrain to do so.

    However, before challenging someone, try to understand that there are numerous contributors in the OS world who contributes to the OS movement without identifying themselves or in aliases, primarily because they don't want to brag. I, as one of advocate of OS for more than a decade (since the days of 286 machines) could be one among them who contributed to the applications at low level (programming languages) which Elastix is based on. You can also find a few of my responses to help the users and forum admin.

    Could you elaborate me what Elastix has contributed to CentOS, PHP, *, GCC, FreePBX, vTiger, SugarCRM and others which it is taking advantage of by just making wrapper scripts?

    As far as the business model of Elastix is concerned, do you think Palosanto guys (the promoters of Elastix) are ignorant even after being a part of the US software industry? I don't believe so. They are aware of what they are doing by releasing Elastix.

    To be popular, I suggest Elastix to think Jim McQullian (of LTSP fame, he was responsive even when he was a single developer) and Ubuntu way. It is NOT me alone, search yourselves in this forum with similar grudges!

    Long live OS community and the user base which inspires them!!

    PS: However, I have a gut feeling that your responses are sponsored!? Maybe wrong!!
     
  11. Bob

    Bob

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2,400
    Likes Received:
    1
    This will be my last message on the subject, just to correct some misconceptions.

    First of all, take a good look at the code, The Elastix Development team don't just write "Wrapper Scripts". There is a fair amount of PHP code they have produced especially in the interface of Elastix. And we are not talking about straight PHP Scripts. They make extensive and good use of PHP Classes. I for one have no issues in following their coding.

    Secondly, the integration work is not a simple issue. I know many, many people who try hard at getting software to integrate properly and give up in disgust. What Elastix does is bring may of these applications to life and to the masses that may not normally have access to this software in a workable form. As a guide, take a guess of how many that have installed Elastix can create a working ISO. I suspect that this figure would be far far less than 10%. I know that Edgar has submitted improvements/corrections/bug reports for some of the other open source products included in Elastix. I know that Trixbox CE has benefited from some of the Elastix code, as Elastix has benefited from the Trixbox code. That is one of the great benefits of the the Open Source Community.

    One of the great things about Open Source software is that communities can build upon it and improve it. To use one of your examples, Vtiger was built upon Sugar (forked). And vTiger to many is a better application. Elastix does the same. To take your analogy further, you could quote that Freepbx takes advantage of Asterisk's work by writing some prepackaged macros, with a few variables chucked in for good measure, but we don't look at that, we look at what they have provided to the community, which is in essence is bringing the Asterisk product to many that would not otherwise be able to appreciate it.

    As for sponsored responses, no, just passionate responses. That same passion that drives you to spend hours of your own time, on community based efforts, much the same as the Author or LTSP (by the way, if you hold him in such high esteem, it would be nice to spell his name correctly).

    Couldn't have said it better myself, but note that the word "inspires" generally means motivates, and this is very rarely done using negative or degrading comments.

    Just lastly, it was not intended to be aimed at you in particular and I apologise that I used your name at the top, but as part of being objective, I was using an example, and yours was close at hand to illustrate what I meant. I always try to use examples where possible, not to humiliate the person involved but to strengthen a point.

    Regards
    Bob
     
  12. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bob:

    I never tried to discredit what Elastix team had done, I just was trying to bring to their attention where they need some focus, too to be a popular among the users. A form of constructive criticism to report subjective bugs of this forum in an objective with my own examples. The reason is science is about being objective, and I have given real life examples to validate.

    Second, about the misspelling of Jim's name in my previous post, what is there in a name and grammar? Even though I misspelled it, you got it, right? Isn't that enough?!

    The purpose of any language is not to be grammatically correct, but to convey messages. Once the message is conveyed, the purpose is fulfilled. That's it!

    About who took what from which OS software, I am more comfortable with command line than GUI. But I am further testing Elastix in OS-level virtual environment (not paravirtualization or hypervirtualization like Xen) as one of my friends wanted so. Once successful, I will post the virtual image and my scripts somewhere without asking for any credit or claiming what I did for this project.

    Also, I shall be writing a single page setup guide for Elastix beginners, subject to my convenience. But that is what I am planning for, but yet can't commit.

    However, I objectively appreciate what you did by creating an alternative forum on Elastix at elastixconnection.com!

    (The timeout in this forum made thrown out again after I submitted the post and I had to retype again, is it a bug or feature or something?! I experienced this 3 times in the past.)
     
  13. Bob

    Bob

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2,400
    Likes Received:
    1
    As mentioned, no more on the subject, but in the vein of being helpful, you have seen the length of posts in previous messages.I haven't experienced any timeouts or similar, and I may have had the message (editing) open for over half an hour or more.

    The only thing I can tell you is that I am using Firefox which generally I use exclusively.

    The only other time I have had to retype a message, was when the actual forum went offline (which was evident only when I went to save the message), and was down for a couple of hours. (this was several months ago)

    Regards

    Bob<br><br>Post edited by: Bob, at: 2008/05/02 01:11
     
  14. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks Bob for taking time to reply.

    I am experiencing the login timeout and I reported. I think there is something with this Joomla Board. Something like punBB is more simple, lighter and adequate for such forums.

    BTW, I had been a Winblows user eons ago. I am on a slacky machine (though I use debian and CentOS fairly) with nothing other than IceWeasel v.2.0.0.14(Firefox without proprietary stuffs) exclusively.

    So I can tell it for sure that it has nothing to do with my setup.
     
  15. zenny

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    0
  16. Bob

    Bob

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2,400
    Likes Received:
    1
    Point noted...

    However, that example is what I meant by providing constructive criticism with examples (if possible) and this one is a good one.

    Hopefully Edgar and crew take it onboard

    Regards

    Bob
     

Share This Page